Comments on: Why Java should focus on the standards http://www.andygibson.net/blog/article/why-java-focus-on-the-standards/ Open Source Projects & Technical Writings Wed, 18 Jan 2012 00:05:55 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Francisco Jose http://www.andygibson.net/blog/article/why-java-focus-on-the-standards/comment-page-1/#comment-84 Francisco Jose Tue, 07 Oct 2008 19:09:35 +0000 http://www.andygibson.net/blog/?p=17#comment-84 I also think that want works is what one should use (it is better if it a standard, but if it is not, I do not care). But AFAIK JUnit is not a standard, it has the same status as TestNG, it just has a broader user base, maybe you think TestNG is better, but the majority uses JUnit. JUnit is a de-facto standard (like Spring is, or Hibernate was), it is standard because everybody uses it, and those are the best standards (Of course you may argue that TestNG is better, but I guess so far the community does not agree with you). I am certified in .NET and I really think it is a great platform (it avoided many of the pitfalls Java fell in, for example, the DateTime API in .NET is much easier to use). But I do not really think that Microsoft is that good setting standard way to work, when I started with .NET I felt really lost, I .NET 1.0 there was a default ugly not scalable and not maintainable way to do things, and not a lot of architectural guidance. I think Java should not try to emulate .NET (that is what Sun Studio Creator tried and failed miserably). I think Java should take a look at the way NextStep WebObjects did things, and try to make the next JEE version what WebObjects 6.0 could have been. I also think that want works is what one should use (it is better if it a standard, but if it is not, I do not care).

But AFAIK JUnit is not a standard, it has the same status as TestNG, it just has a broader user base, maybe you think TestNG is better, but the majority uses JUnit. JUnit is a de-facto standard (like Spring is, or Hibernate was), it is standard because everybody uses it, and those are the best standards (Of course you may argue that TestNG is better, but I guess so far the community does not agree with you).

I am certified in .NET and I really think it is a great platform (it avoided many of the pitfalls Java fell in, for example, the DateTime API in .NET is much easier to use). But I do not really think that Microsoft is that good setting standard way to work, when I started with .NET I felt really lost, I .NET 1.0 there was a default ugly not scalable and not maintainable way to do things, and not a lot of architectural guidance. I think Java should not try to emulate .NET (that is what Sun Studio Creator tried and failed miserably). I think Java should take a look at the way NextStep WebObjects did things, and try to make the next JEE version what WebObjects 6.0 could have been.

]]> By: raveman http://www.andygibson.net/blog/article/why-java-focus-on-the-standards/comment-page-1/#comment-79 raveman Tue, 07 Oct 2008 08:05:16 +0000 http://www.andygibson.net/blog/?p=17#comment-79 So you think project like log4j should be closed and deprecated, because it doesnt fallow the standard that was created because of this project? (jdk logging doesnt have debug level, they called something else just to show whos the boss). Many standards are broken(like JSF) and the reason is that it was standard first, before people started using it, so to use JSF you need some sub-projects that make it usable (Faclets, Seam). When you create standard it should be after some cool technology was used for longer period of time and is realy needed (like Joda Time that will soon be a standard). JPA is great because all the bad ideas were found and fixed when people were using Hibernate. I think we have too much standards in Java world. Standards should be like JPA and not JSF. Another good example is TestNG and JUnit, JUnit is the standard, but TestNG has some cool features. TestNG is little bit different (assertEquals has revearsed params). It is almost the same thing as JUnit and I see no reason why not to use it. So you think project like log4j should be closed and deprecated, because it doesnt fallow the standard that was created because of this project? (jdk logging doesnt have debug level, they called something else just to show whos the boss).

Many standards are broken(like JSF) and the reason is that it was standard first, before people started using it, so to use JSF you need some sub-projects that make it usable (Faclets, Seam).
When you create standard it should be after some cool technology was used for longer period of time and is realy needed (like Joda Time that will soon be a standard). JPA is great because all the bad ideas were found and fixed when people were using Hibernate.

I think we have too much standards in Java world. Standards should be like JPA and not JSF.

Another good example is TestNG and JUnit, JUnit is the standard, but TestNG has some cool features. TestNG is little bit different (assertEquals has revearsed params). It is almost the same thing as JUnit and I see no reason why not to use it.

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